Yugoslavia

[Gargantua]

The rules state that Yugoslavia can be invaded by Italy without a declaration of war on England.

But the rules also state the all Yugoslavian units become British.

In a recent game, the Yugoslavian player opted to place his units in the north west of Yugoslavia, and attack Italian home territories.  The Italian player intimated that it was an illegal move to attack Italy, because that was a D.O.W. by England.

Then the question came that can Yugoslavian units, that are now british, attack anything? for example, Yugoslavian territories,  And if they can, can those attacks be coordinated with british air support or other elements?

And can Yugoslavia be reinforced with British Units for a proxy war?

[John D.]

So unless the Italians sucessfully take a factory territory or the Germans declare war on Yugoslavia or Greece, the Western Allies can not declare war. In the meantime the British player controls the units. Western Allies can begin fighting (mixing units together) once at war with Axis.
Make sense?

[Mark]

OK - so rules should state that Yugoslav units are controlled by the British player, not that they become British units - I'll need to correct that as well.

Yugoslavia is neutral and can't attack anyone until attacked.  If a neutral Italy (not yet at war with England) declares war on Yugoslavia and attacks it, Italy and Yugoslavia are at war (but Italy is not at war with England and Yugoslavia is not at war with Germany).  Italian units can enter and attack Yugoslavia & Yugoslavian units can enter and attack Italy once they are at war. 

Once Italy is allied to Germany (by declaring war on the Allies - like attacking France), Yugoslavia will then join the Allies (if they are already at war with Italy).

Keep in mind that Italy is neutral early in the war.  A neutral Italy declaring war on another neutral (like Yugoslavia) sets up a war between those two neutrals - and does not involve Britain or Germany.  Only once Italy is at war with Britain, does Yugoslavia become an Allied minor and join the Allies.

In the real war, Britain wanted to try to keep Italy neutral and did not declare war on Italy during Italy's aggression again Greece.  The Greeks also did not want to antagonize Germany by seeking British help and potentially bringing German wrath down upon them.  The rules for Yugoslavia and Greece and a (neutral) Italy reflect these diplomatic tensions.

 

[Darkman]

OK - so rules should state that Yugoslav units are controlled by the British player, not that they become British units - I'll need to correct that as well.

Yugoslavia is neutral and can't attack anyone until attacked.  If a neutral Italy (not yet at war with England) declares war on Yugoslavia and attacks it, Italy and Yugoslavia are at war (but Italy is not at war with England and Yugoslavia is not at war with Germany).  Italian units can enter and attack Yugoslavia & Yugoslavian units can enter and attack Italy once they are at war. 

Once Italy is allied to Germany (by declaring war on the Allies - like attacking France), Yugoslavia will then join the Allies (if they are already at war with Italy).

Keep in mind that Italy is neutral early in the war.  A neutral Italy declaring war on another neutral (like Yugoslavia) sets up a war between those two neutrals - and does not involve Britain or Germany.  Only once Italy is at war with Britain, does Yugoslavia become an Allied minor and join the Allies.

In the real war, Britain wanted to try to keep Italy neutral and did not declare war on Italy during Italy's aggression again Greece.  The Greeks also did not want to antagonize Germany by seeking British help and potentially bringing German wrath down upon them.  The rules for Yugoslavia and Greece and a (neutral) Italy reflect these diplomatic tensions.

Mark the rules need some fixing then.

Italy attacked the allies in June 1940 , and Greece in October 1940.

If you would join the axis in summer 1940 , and attack greece in autumn 1940, you would always have to deal instantly with yugoslavia. The Invasion on Yugoslavia was April 1941

i would say change to the rule to that if italy declares war on yugoslavia or greece the other nation doesn't automatically join the allies , even when italy belongs to the axis already.

[georgemak1]

I usually take Yugoslavia out as soon as Hungary and Romania join the axis. You can attack the 2 factory spaces with them and have Yugoslavia surrender at the end of the turn without Italian or German involvement. Am I doing this right or is there something that I'm missing?